Comments on: How to kill an open source project… http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/ Conning people into thinking I'm intelligent. Since 1982. Thu, 09 Feb 2012 08:24:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-770 Swaroop C H Fri, 01 Apr 2005 09:43:03 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-770 Philip: Did you read the second part of that sentence? To steal someone's words, "It's the community, stupid!" Philip: Did you read the second part of that sentence?

To steal someone’s words, “It’s the community, stupid!”

]]> By: Philip http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-771 Philip Thu, 31 Mar 2005 13:59:07 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-771 Hmm. Yahoo! hired the lead developer of libyahoo2. That didn't stop development on the project. Hmm. Yahoo! hired the lead developer of libyahoo2. That didn’t stop development on the project.

]]> By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-769 Swaroop C H Mon, 28 Mar 2005 19:10:02 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-769 Update: Clarification regarding IronPython's license is at [Jason Matusow's MSDN blog](http://blogs.msdn.com/jasonmatusow/archive/2005/03/28/402940.aspx). Update: Clarification regarding IronPython’s license is at [Jason Matusow's MSDN blog](http://blogs.msdn.com/jasonmatusow/archive/2005/03/28/402940.aspx).

]]> By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-768 Swaroop C H Mon, 28 Mar 2005 17:19:04 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-768 Sriram: Full VS.NET support would be good indeed, I agree. Your second sentence is highly ambiguous. I am sorry but my interpretation of Jim's mail clearly differs from your interpretation of it. Maybe you mean to say that the open source community was naive in expecting a 'true open source project' because we should never have expected anything like that from the company that hired Jim? Well, I guess I can agree with that. MS is never going to be ‘good’ for Free Software? I think it comes down to that, yes. Sriram: Full VS.NET support would be good indeed, I agree.

Your second sentence is highly ambiguous. I am sorry but my interpretation of Jim’s mail clearly differs from your interpretation of it. Maybe you mean to say that the open source community was naive in expecting a ‘true open source project’ because we should never have expected anything like that from the company that hired Jim? Well, I guess I can agree with that.

MS is never going to be ‘good’ for Free Software? I think it comes down to that, yes.

]]> By: Sriram http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-767 Sriram Mon, 28 Mar 2005 14:50:31 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-767 David - did you take a look at FePy 0.6? There was so little of it - MS could have probably written it in a few weeks. I don't think FePy is going to be killed off. In fact, I think it's the opposite - FePy might become a full-fledged member of the MS stable of languages which would be really cool (read 'full VS.NET' support). Also, as Grant already pointed out, FePy was never open source.And if you read Swaroop's quote from Jim's mail, he talks about 'help' from the open source community but never mentions anything about people working on the codebase itself.People 'assumed' that it would be a 'true open source' project - and obviously that hasn't come to be. If MS wanted to 'kill' FePy, I doubt the most effective way is to do a ton of improvements and release the source code to 0.7.This thing runs around 80% faster than CPython (going by Jim's Pystone benchmarks). Even if Jim is exaggerating, those are some staggering numbers. FePy has already helped Mono - running the FePy benchmarks helped them sort out quite a few perf issues with exception handling. I see no reason for MS to ever be 'good' for Free Software. If you read up gnu.org or fsf.org, it's not exactly as if they want a glowing future for Microsoft too. Swaroop hit the nail on the head there. If you're looking for a 'true open source project', don't look here. If you're looking for a project where you can look at and fork the source code and use it any way you want, then this is right for you. Mr.Anonymous - searching the web really isn't necessary when you have the archives of the FePy mailing list :). If you want to talk about my 'FUD', feel free to mail me at ksriram _at_ gmx DOT net David – did you take a look at FePy 0.6? There was so little of it – MS could have probably written it in a few weeks. I don’t think FePy is going to be killed off. In fact, I think it’s the opposite – FePy might become a full-fledged member of the MS stable of languages which would be really cool (read ‘full VS.NET’ support).

Also, as Grant already pointed out, FePy was never open source.And if you read Swaroop’s quote from Jim’s mail, he talks about ‘help’ from the open source community but never mentions anything about people working on the codebase itself.People ‘assumed’ that it would be a ‘true open source’ project – and obviously that hasn’t come to be.

If MS wanted to ‘kill’ FePy, I doubt the most effective way is to do a ton of improvements and release the source code to 0.7.This thing runs around 80% faster than CPython (going by Jim’s Pystone benchmarks). Even if Jim is exaggerating, those are some staggering numbers. FePy has already helped Mono – running the FePy benchmarks helped them sort out quite a few perf issues with exception handling.

I see no reason for MS to ever be ‘good’ for Free Software. If you read up gnu.org or fsf.org, it’s not exactly as if they want a glowing future for Microsoft too.

Swaroop hit the nail on the head there. If you’re looking for a ‘true open source project’, don’t look here. If you’re looking for a project where you can look at and fork the source code and use it any way you want, then this is right for you.

Mr.Anonymous – searching the web really isn’t necessary when you have the archives of the FePy mailing list :) . If you want to talk about my ‘FUD’, feel free to mail me at ksriram _at_ gmx DOT net

]]> By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-766 Swaroop C H Mon, 28 Mar 2005 04:36:55 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-766 Mr. Anonymous, sorry to say this but your comment would've been more credible if you actually used your real name instead of hiding behind an anonymous tag. Mr. Anonymous, sorry to say this but your comment would’ve been more credible if you actually used your real name instead of hiding behind an anonymous tag.

]]> By: Anonymous http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-765 Anonymous Mon, 28 Mar 2005 03:59:36 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-765 I wonder how Sriram will reply to David Mertz. Is he still searching the web to create the FUD? I wonder how Sriram will reply to David Mertz. Is he still searching the web to create the FUD?

]]> By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-764 Swaroop C H Mon, 28 Mar 2005 02:35:30 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-764 All said and done, I do not doubt Jim's intentions but other factors are probably leading him to have such restrictions. I would hate to see that IronPython would not be embraced by many people because of these factors. We just have to face the fact that it is not an open source project, just a source-open project. All said and done, I do not doubt Jim’s intentions but other factors are probably leading him to have such restrictions. I would hate to see that IronPython would not be embraced by many people because of these factors. We just have to face the fact that it is not an open source project, just a source-open project.

]]> By: Swaroop C H http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-761 Swaroop C H Mon, 28 Mar 2005 00:46:22 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-761 Grant, here is an excerpt [from a mail by Jim himself](http://listserver.dreamhost.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/2004-August/000092.html): > There've been many good questions about the future of IronPython development > and about how people can most effectively contribute to further development. > I want to thank everyone who's offered to help. I've sometimes been > frustrated by people who complain about open source projects not moving fast > enough and want the lead developers to just work harder. Those people who > don't just complain but offer to work to make things better are one of the > best parts of a good open source community. > I want to let you all know as much as I can today about my future > development work on IronPython. I still expect to lead the development of > IronPython to a stable and complete 1.0 release. One part of my decision to > go to Microsoft is to have an employer who will fully support me in > achieving this. I know that I could never have found the time to do this on > my own as a hobby project. This was 7 months ago. Grant, here is an excerpt [from a mail by Jim himself](http://listserver.dreamhost.com/pipermail/users-ironpython.com/2004-August/000092.html):

> There’ve been many good questions about the future of IronPython development
> and about how people can most effectively contribute to further development.
> I want to thank everyone who’s offered to help. I’ve sometimes been
> frustrated by people who complain about open source projects not moving fast
> enough and want the lead developers to just work harder. Those people who
> don’t just complain but offer to work to make things better are one of the
> best parts of a good open source community.

> I want to let you all know as much as I can today about my future
> development work on IronPython. I still expect to lead the development of
> IronPython to a stable and complete 1.0 release. One part of my decision to
> go to Microsoft is to have an employer who will fully support me in
> achieving this. I know that I could never have found the time to do this on
> my own as a hobby project.

This was 7 months ago.

]]> By: Sriram http://www.swaroopch.com/blog/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/comment-page-1/#comment-763 Sriram Sun, 27 Mar 2005 20:30:05 +0000 http://swaroop.textdriven.com/archives/2005/03/27/how-to-kill-an-open-source-project/#comment-763 Raj - IronPython is way too young for anything to be done on it yet. But the possibilities are mouth-watering Raj – IronPython is way too young for anything to be done on it yet. But the possibilities are mouth-watering

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